| Notes on Plato'sgodliness when they do not understand it. |
| Notes on Plato'sgodliness when they do not understand it. |
1. Socrates is being accused by Meletus for corrupting the youth of Athens.
2. Socrates says that "of this our mother the state is to be the judge."
3. Meletus claims that Socrates is a poet or maker of gods, and that he invents new gods and denies the existence of old ones.
4. Euthyphro says he is also unjustly accused: of speaking in the assembly of divine things and of foretelling the future. He claims that every word he speaks is true and his accusers are merely jealous of him.
5. Athenians, Socrates says, do not much trouble themselves with anyone unless that person begins to impart his wisdom to others.
6. In jest, Socrates says that he has a benevolent habit of pouring himself out to everybody, and would even pay for a listener, and he is afraid that the Athenians may think him too talkative.
7. Euthyphro is accusing his own father of murder.
8. Most men, says Socrates, would not know how to bring such an accusation and consider themselves to be correct in their action. Only one who is far advanced in wisdom could do this with justification.
9. Euthyphro says he is cleansing himself and his father by bringing him to justice.
10. Euthyphro's father had bound a murderer for judgment and the man died in captivity because of neglect.
11. Socrates points out to Euthyphro that his actions imply that he knows without question what is the nature of godliness, ungodliness, and the divine.
12. Euthyphro agrees that he would not be superior to most men--as he is--if he didn't have precisely that knowledge.
13. Socrates suggests (ironically) that he become the student of Euthyphro in learning what is true godliness and inform Meletus that he is diligently studying with the master teacher Euthyphro in gaining an understanding of virtue.
14. Socrates says that he will tell Meletus that if he thinks Euthyphro is an expert in virtue, then Socrates should not be accused. And if Euthyphro does not think Euthyphro an expert in godliness, then Meletus should accuse Euthyphro, the teacher, instead of Socrates, the pupil.
15. Euthyphro is quite willing for Socrates to follow that plan. He says that if Meletus accuses him, he will find Meletus' weak spots and attack him at those points.
16. Socrates tells Euthyphro that he must now inform his new pupil, Socrates, what he claims to know: the nature of godliness and ungodliness.
17. Godliness, says Euthyphro, is the prosecution of the wrongdoer. 5e
18. Euthyphro supports his assertion by pointing out that Zeus bound his own father and castrated him because he swallowd his own sons.
19. Socrates says that he is being accused because he can't accept such religious myths as those about Zeus and the other gods.
20. Socrates points out that Euthyphro has merely told him about one godly act and has not taught Socrates the form of all godly acts. 6e
21. Euthyphro says, confidently, that what is dear to the gods is godliness and what is not dear to the gods is ungodliness.
22. Socrates points out that Euthyphro and others who accept the popular gods believe that the gods disagree with one another and fight among themselves. 7b
23. Then the various gods--according to Euthyphro's own belief system--consider different things to be godly or ungodly. This means that the same thing is both godly and ungodly at the same time--as recognized by disgreeing gods. 8a
24. Both men and gods, Socrates says, agree that a wrongdoer should be punished, but they disagree that they themselves are wrongdoers.
25. Euthyphro changes his definition and now states that godliness is what all the gods hold dear and what all the gods do not hold dear is ungodliness.
26. Euthyphro agrees with Socrates that merely because someone says something is true does not make it true, so it is necessary to examine what is meant by Euthyphro's new definition and determine if is true or not.
27. Socrates asks: is something godly because it is loved by the gods, or is it loved by the gods because it is godly?
28. Euthyphro says that something is loved by the gods because it is godly.
29. So godliness or holiness, Socrates point out, is determined independent of being loved by the gods; the fact that something is loved by the gods does not make it holy or godly.
30. Euthyphro complains that the elements of their discussion do not remain stable, but change as the discussion proceeds. Euthyphro blames Socrates for these changes.
31. Socrates (in jest) says that if this is true that he is clever without wanting to be, for he would prefer that Euthyphro's concepts remain stable instead of changing as they are.
32. Socrates asks Euthyphro whether all holy things are just or only some holy thing are just. Euthyphro says he does not understand.
33. Socrates (ironically) says that Euthyphro is pretending not to understand because of the wealth of his wisdom.
34. Socrates asks Euthyphro what part of just things, godly things are.
35. Euthyphro answers that godly things are those among just things which have to do with the care of the gods, and the other just elements have to do with the care of humans.
36. Socrates points out that that when we speak of "caring for" something we usually mean we are trying to improve it.
37. Euthyphro denies that that is what he means by "caring for the gods."
38. Godliness, Euthyphro says, is knowledge of how to give to and beg from the gods, a kind of trading between humans and gods.
39. Socrates points out that the argument has circled around to saying that godliness is what is dear to the gods, which contradicts what Euthyphro said earlier, that godliness is independent of being approved by the gods.
40. Socrates points out that Euthyphro has not really proved that he understands godliness, yet his act of prosecuting his father for murder implies that he has that understanding.
